[Hari-katha of Nitya Lila Pravista Om Visnupada Astottara Sata Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Gosvami Maharaja Srila Gurudeva]
[The following transcription is a translation of Srila Gurudeva’s conversation with the devotees in Hindi] Listen
Srila Gurudeva: Therefore, you can call Laksmiji as “Maiya,” mother.
Srila Gurudeva: You can call Sitaji—Maiya as well. You should only call her mother; don’t address her as your friend. You can consider the girls of Janakapuri as your friends. Rama is not different from Krsna, but there is some difference in rasa. He is Maryada-Purusottama and Krsna is Lila-Purusottama. This is the difference. Don’t make Radhaji sit with Dvarakadisa or Rama; beware!
Do you understand something?
Srila Gurudeva: What did you understand?
Radhaji should be seated alongside Krsna; but which Krsna? Nanda-nandana, Yasoda-nandana, Radhakanta, Muralidhara; Srimati Radhaji should be seated with this Krsna. Satyabhama sits next to Dvarakadisa. Sitaji sits with Rama. It will be a great injustice from your side if you make Radhaji sit next to Dvarakadisa or Ramacandra. It will be an offense. You should not do this. Dvarakadisa doesn’t play on the flute; He doesn’t have a peacock feather adorning His crest; and He is not the son of Nanda-Yasoda. He is the son of Vasudeva-Devaki. And He has no flute at all. Then, we should not make Radhaji sit next to Him. You can make Rukmini and Satyabhama sit next to Him. Or, you can make Dvarakadisa sit on the chariot with Arjuna. But He will never sit with Radhaji. Radhaji will not even go near Him. She will not look at Him even from far.
Once, Krsna manifested His four-handed caturbhuja form in Vrndavana. Looking at Him, the gopis went away. They have no relation with Him. They have nothing to ask and nothing to take. Therefore, Radhaji and the gopis have no relation with Dvarakadisa. Understanding these considerations, you should be fixed in Krsna’s bhajan. Without a guru, you will not have a relationship with Krsna.
bina guru bhavanidhi kare no koi
yo viranca sankarsano
Even if one is a jnani, who is as knowledgeable as Sankara or Brahma; yet, without the grace of an exalted spiritual master, he will not have a relation with Krsna. Thus, he can never attain the lotus feet of Krsna even in millions and millions of lives without this knowledge of sambandha-jnana. In this way, we should gradually advance in our Krsna consciousness. If there was no Naradaji, then how could have personalities like Prahlada, Druvaji, the sons of the progenitor Daksa, and Vyasaji be enlightened? Vyasaji is also the disciple of Naradaji. If this Guru-parampara was not there, then where would have Sukadeva Gosvami come from? Therefore, you should follow this line of thought of the Guru-parampara. Just accepting any guru will not do. A guru who follows the parampara is needed. If you remove even one Acarya from the parampara, the line will be cut. Therefore, we should join everyone. We have no relation with a guru who doesn’t accept the parampara and who doesn’t follow their teachings. If he is not in the parampara, if he doesn’t do the bhajan of Radha-Krsna, and if he doesn’t give such teachings; rather, teaches according to his whims, then what relation can you have with such a guru?
We have no relation with such a guru who although says, “I am a bona fide guru,” he cannot make one’s heart advance towards Krsna. Guru and Vaisnavas are the same; they are not separate from each other. If there is an exalted Vaisnava, he will become a guru. And such a guru is also a Vaisnava. Day and night, Rupa-Sanatana would be absorbed in remembering Radha-Krsna.
One should not think, “Being in the grhasta-asrama, we cannot do bhajan.”
Even if a person is a householder, yet if he doesn’t talk with his wife and parents and is unattached to his family affairs, then this is not the purport of the sastras. A man lives with his wife in the house, but has no relationship with her—this is not our Indian culture. The wife is considered to be one half of her husband. Together, they should do bhajan. It is not that the husband should never talk to his wife because he might beget a son from her. Then why did he get married if he didn’t want any children from her?
A guru will not say, “Don’t make a house. Rather, you should give me whatever money you have.”
A guru should not be absorbed in accumulating his disciple’s wealth. A bona fide guru’s wealth is his bhakti to Krsna. Who can be a better householder than the gopis? Many of our Mahaprabhu’s devotees were also householders. They were very exalted. Some of the householders become sannyasis or tyagis. Naradaji is a topmost devotee of Krsna. But, he hankers for the footdust of the gopis. If the gopis come across Narada, they will offer their pranama to him and take the footdust of his lotus feet. Therefore, when they go away, Narada takes their footdust and rolls down on the earth, covering himself with the footdust of their lotus feet. He wants the mood of the gopis. But he cannot have that mood. He cannot be like the gopis, who control Krsna.
If Krsna will see the gopis coming, He will say, “Oh Narada, go away. Go away.”
Therefore, you should understand this. The name of this process is bhakti. We should become established in this.
Visnu dasa: Maharaja, I want to ask you something. Harilila Prabhu asked me, “I want to take some instructions from Maharaja. What to do?”
Srila Gurudeva: This devotee’s question has been left unanswered.
Devotee: I will ask later Gurudeva.
Srila Gurudeva: You will ask later?
Srila Gurudeva: Will you ask when I leave?
Devotee: No, no.
Srila Gurudeva: One or two days still remain. You may ask all the questions you have tomorrow.
Visnu dasa: Maharaja, he says, “The temple authorities have decided that I cannot enter the temple and engage in the deity worship.”
Srila Gurudeva: They have ordered?
Visnu dasa: They will call to inform their decision. They are going to ban him from entering the temple.
Srila Gurudeva: All right. Sadhu-sanga will not be obtained there. If no devotees are found there, then it is your duty to leave them.
Visnu dasa: He says, “Maharaja, please bless me that I don’t have any bad feelings towards them.”
Srila Gurudeva: They won’t come. This is such dirty politics. I tutored them and helped them. Svamiji told me, “After my departure, give them Siksa.” I have served Svamiji long before ISKCON was established. But now, these people have become ISKCON. They tell devotees to not let me come to their homes. If I go for bhiksa to any devotee’s house, they tell the devotee, “Don’t give bhiksa.” Is this Vaisnavata?
These actions are all opposite to bhakti. You should not be worried. One day, they will realize.
Devotee: There is some confusion because some devotees would like to hear your lectures, but they cannot because they are being ordered not to go.
Srila Gurudeva: It seems that even Hiranyakasipu has not done this. Even Ravana has not done this. What are they doing? They are cutting their own legs with an axe. They call mayavadis who put tripundra-tilak, and they call cinema-actresses to the temple; but I cannot go there. Anyone who meets me cannot go there. Is this a temple or not? They have not built the temple with their own property; they have built the temple by collections. If anyone files a case against them, they will have to open the temple for all. In England, they have done like so.
Visnu dasa: Maharaja, you gave the deity of Girirajaji here.
Srila Gurudeva: Yes. I gave Girirajaji’s deity.
Visnu dasa: Will Girirajaji stay in a place where Vaisnavas are offended?
Srila Gurudeva: He will leave after a few days.
[Srila Gurudeva speaks in English]
Did you hear what he said? They said that he cannot go to the temple because he is coming to see me.
Devotee: I am sorry to hear this. This is completely against the truth. It is not what my Guru Maharaja has taught. I have studied with my Guru Maharaja; I have travelled with my Guru Maharaja—Srila Prabhupada Bhaktivedanta Svami in India. In India, I sat with Srila Prabhupada in Jagannatha Puri. And one day, we had all the mahants of Jagannatha Puri in a big Pandal programme they had for him to come. For three hours, Bhaktivedanta Svami spoke to all the mahants.
He said, “You are worshiping Jagannatha. “Jaga,” means everyone, the whole universe. So, how can you go in and these young boys who are also worshiping cannot go in?”
For three hours, he spoke only sastra and logical arguments that we could go into the temple. Now, someone who is so dear to Prabhupada’s heart is not being allowed to enter his temples. It is so clear; you have to be a blind man or a deaf man to not see it. They are not letting him in the temple. It is exactly against everything that my Guru Maharaja stood for.
Srila Gurudeva: I have never spoken a word against ISKCON, the devotees, temples, or Svamiji. I have regarded like my Siksa-Guru. I have served him more than they have served. But yet..
Bhakti has no such boundaries.
Devotee: GBC ruling has not said.
Srila Gurudeva: They are ruling that they are controlling Krsna and Goloka Vrndavana Dhama. They say the whole world is theirs. They can control anyone. They will tell afterwards that “He cannot go to Goloka Vrndavana.”
Devotee: Local devotees say, “You have to follow guru’s instructions otherwise you will have to suffer.”
Srila Gurudeva: But it is quite wrong. Bali Maharaja left his Gurudeva because he was a wall that stood in his love and affection for Vamanadeva. There are so many such instances.
I pray that Krsna gives them good intelligence. If you cannot serve one guest, then how are you following dharma? They have no relationship with dharma. It seems they are worse than even Hiranyakasipu and Ravana if they do like this. They should be respectful. I have helped so much. But, they have forgotten and are ungrateful. They should not forget. I will serve even a dog that has served Svamiji. And I have served Svamiji so much.
Don’t tell them to meet me. Don’t request. I will never speak a word against them.
Devotee: I don’t misunderstand the local temple devotees. I feel that they are being forced by bad circumstances.
Devotee 2: The local devotees are very good.
Devotee 3: Some of them want to come, but they are being told to not go.
Srila Gurudeva: If a senior Vaisnava is speaking, then how can devotees be told to not go?
Devotee: There is one situation when the Nazis were killing so many people in the Second World War There was one Catholic priest who wrote a poem. He said that when they were coming, then they came for the Jews. He let them take the Jews. When they came for the gypsies, he let them take the gypsies. And when they were coming for this one and that one, he let them take.
The priest lastly said, “And then, when they came for me, no one was left to stop them from taking me.”
Every man in his heart has to act for truth. That is the point.
Srila Gurudeva: One day, they will realize all of this.
[Break of audio]
Srila Gurudeva: Citraketu Maharaja told Angira Rsi, “You are born of Lord Brahma’s mind. Be merciful to me and bless me with a son.”
Angira Rsi replied, “All right. I give you this sweet rice. Give it to any one of your queens.”
Citraketu Maharaja had many queens, but none of them gave him a son.
Angira Rsi told the King, “Have any of your queens eat this sweet rice and she will become pregnant. Soon, you will have a son. But, that son will be a cause of great jubilation and lamentation.”
The King thought, “Oh this is all right. I may lament when my son doesn’t listen to me. But this is no problem.”
The Sage then gave the sweet rice. Angira Rsi went to the forest and leaving his body in a secure place, by his soul, he entered the womb of the queen to whom the Citraketu Maharaja had given the sweet rice. In time, a son was born. When he became five years of age, he was so beautiful. Seeing the son, everyone became happy and everyone congratulated each other in the Kingdom.
But, the other queens of the King, who were more than a thousand in number thought, “The King would speak to us before. But now he is only concerned about his son and only asks about his well-being. We have become worse than maidservants. This boy is the cause of our distress.”
All the queens then gave the boy poison and he immediately died. Now, anguish filled all four directions. Those queens, who had administered the poison also wept bitterly. Their cries were the loudest. Their anguish at the boy’s death was a show. By chance, Narada Rsi and Angira Rsi appeared in the palace. Angira Rsi returned to his previous body after having given up the body of a boy. He appeared with his selfsame body. They saw how everyone was crying and there was no one to pacify them.
Angira Rsi asked, “Why is everyone crying?”
Someone said, “The son of the King has died.”
“Where is he?”
“Oh he is laying down here.”
“No. The body doesn’t have life. By your cries, will the body come back to life? Will the boy be brought back to life even if all the residents of this world cry together?
He will not be brought back to life. He, who has taken birth, will have to surely die. This is the Lord’s arrangement. All of you should not cry. Before this boy was born, what relationship did you have with him? Now that he is dead, why don’t you keep him on your lap and look after him?
You will say, ‘No. Many worms will appear on his body; so we cannot keep him with us.’
Why will these worms appear? Did you see the soul inside his body? Is the soul black or white in color? What is the soul’s height and weight?
You will say, ‘I did not see.’
Then why are you lamenting for someone you did not really see? And the person who you looked after is now ‘sleeping.’ So, why are you crying?” asked Angira Rsi.
I will narrate one story. There were a couple of pigeons who were looking after their young ones. One day, they went to the bank of a river and saw that some birds were on one tree. So, they also sat on one branch of the tree. They saw some grains of rice on the ground.
The wife of the pigeon said, “Let’s take some of these grains. We can eat some and feed our young ones as well.”
The husband replied, “Don’t go. This is definitely a trap. If we fall into this trap, we will surely die.”
But the wife replied, “No. I will go get some grains.”
Surely enough, as soon as she flew down and stood on the ground to take the grains, a net was thrown and she was captured. She cried out for help. Unable to tolerate this sight, the husband also cried out. One pigeon was inside the net and the other was outside loudly weeping.
The pigeon cried out, “I cannot take care of the children. My wife would look after and nourish our children. It would have been better if I would have died and she would have survived.”
As the pigeon lamented and wept, the hunter took aim and shot him down. Thus, the husband died. The wife was as good as dead. So, the hunter took both of them home, cooked and ate them. Similarly, no one knows when he or she will die. No one can be a cause of peace and happiness for others in this material world. Therefore, while working for the maintenance of our lives, we must be engaged in Krsna’s bhajan as well. It is not difficult to do Krsna’s bhajan, just remember and chant His names.
Chant, Hare Krsna Hare Krsna Krsna Krsna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare.
Don’t be cruel to others. If you can do something good to others, then work for their benefit. Don’t criticize anyone and don’t become anyone’s enemy. Thus, maintain your life and do Krsna’s bhajan. Be situated in whatever arrangement Krsna has made. Always have faith in Krsna. And, don’t fear from any problems. This is sraddha. Anguish and happiness will come on their own. When they come, consider them both to be brothers. When anguish will come, it will go on its own. Happiness will also come and go on its own. Be equipoised in all circumstances; always have a control over yourself.
Athiti-deva-bhavoh; always respectfully receive a guest. Tend to the needs of others as much as possible; money and other things will not go with us when you leave your body. Even your house will not go; nothing will go. Work for the welfare of everyone. Don’t commit violence towards birds and animals.
Devotee: Maharajaji, it has been many days since I have chanted.
Srila Gurudeva: Chant harinama even while sitting in your house. This is my instruction. Chant gradually.
Devotee: I chant a little.
Srila Gurudeva: Okay, chant a little at least. Try to realize that “Krsna is mine.” And, the jivatma needs realizations. Slowly, realizations will also come. Or else, one will continue to be entangled in this samsara. Now you have a human body, but who knows what body you will get in your next life? There is no guarantee. Therefore, you can achieve the grace of Krsna in this human form of life. Every day, spend a little time chanting harinama during the morning or evening. You will get energy.
Devotee: I chant in the car and at other times, Guruji. While working, I have to travel here and there.
Srila Gurudeva: You have to do this.
There is no need to fear from death because the soul doesn’t die. Earlier, you were a child in this body. Then you became a youth and now you have become a middle-aged man. How old are you?
Devotee: I am forty years old.
Srila Gurudeva: Then forty years have passed. You will live for another sixty or seventy years in this world. To live this long is enough.
Devotee: If I will live for another twenty years it is enough. I want my children to stand on their legs.
Srila Gurudeva: We cannot do everything; we are helpless. There is only one help—the place where Krsna is there. He will save us. Therefore, in whatever position you are in, always remember Krsna’s names. There is nothing greater than remembering Krsna’s names. In our Bharatavarsa, there was a saint called Tulasidasji who wrote Rama-caritra-manasa.
He said, “I will tell you something. There is happiness and distress in this material world. But, the purport of all the sastras is that without doing Krsna’s bhajan, you cannot cross this samsara, this material world.”
In India, the rabbit doesn’t have horns. So, Tulasidasji says, “It may be possible for the rabbit to grow horns; it may also be possible for darkness to cover the sun, although this will never happen. I will also agree to the fact that it may be possible for fire to arise from ice. Flowers may also bloom in the sky. And, ghee may also be obtained from churning water. Oil may also be extracted from the dust of this world. The occurrence of such events may be possible; but, without doing Hari-bhajan and chanting Krsna’s names, the conditioned soul can never cross this material world.”
The Srimad Bhagavatam is considered more exalted than even the Vedas. The Bhagavat is the essence of the Vedas. Vyasaji manifested this Bhagavat from his samadhi and spoke it to his son, Sukadeva Gosvami. And, Sukadeva Gosvami recited the Bhagavat to Pariksit Maharaja. Pariksit Maharaja was destined to die after seven days. After listening to the Bhagavat for seven days, he surpassed this material world and got Krsna-prema. This Bhagavat is so sublime. Day and night, we are always drowning in this nectarean ocean of the Bhagavat.
[Break of audio]
Srila Gurudeva: If his name is Prakasananda and if he is an advaitavadi; do you know who an advaitavadi is?
He will say, “I am Brahma. Sarvam khalv idam brahma. Everyone is Brahma.”
If someone is speaking like this, then know that he is an advaitavadi. They say, “This world is false.” Our tattva-siddhanta is different from theirs.
Devotee: I have met his devotees. They say, “You will have to live in this material world. You cannot get away from it. But you should associate with the devotees.” They say you cannot get out of this material world.
Srila Gurudeva: This is not told in the Bhagavatam. This is the inconsistency. Our Bhagavat and Gita say otherwise. In the Gita, Krsna says, “One who does My bhajan will not be born again.”
yad gatva na nivartante
tad dhama paramam mama
—Bhagavad Gita 15.6
This world is filled with sorrow. There are many thorns of sufferings here. Even if there is happiness, it is mixed with sorrow. Therefore, by engaging in bhajan, the body and mind will be relinquished and becoming pure, the devotee will enter Krsna’s abode.
Devotee: I don’t know their philosophy fully.
Srila Gurudeva: I know that a person who bears the name, “Prakasananda,” is a follower of the mayavad philosophy. They engage in Bhagavan’s bhajan also.
Devotee: They worship Radhe-Krsna. They chant, “Radhe Radhe.”
Srila Gurudeva: Then by Bhagavan’s mercy, their devotion should become pure. It is all right as long as you don’t associate with them and as long as you don’t adopt their conceptions. There was one speaker of the Bhagavat in Vrndavana who was an advaitavadi. He is dead now and his disciples speak now. They also speak some Gaudiya Vaisnava philosophy. They don’t speak anything separate.
Devotee: They say that by doing arati and chanting on the mala, nothing will happen.
Srila Gurudeva: It is wrong to say that nothing will happen. Something will happen—sorrows will be dispelled, and one will cross over this samsara.
Devotee: Sukriti will also be made.
Srila Gurudeva: But, a place in Vraja will not be had. The person will not become an associate of Krsna like the gopis, or sakhas.
I will go to Holland and return to India.
Devotee: We are going to miss you so much Maharaja.
Srila Gurudeva: The residents of Mathura and Vrndavana are crying in separation from me.
Devotee: Maharaja, as long as you were here, we would always talk about you. Now for whom will we live?
Srila Gurudeva: These memories will make you stay alive.
Devotee: Maharaja, the devotees are crying for you. Even Tamala Krsnaji says, “We are crying to see you.” But the devotees are not able to make a decision on their own.
Srila Gurudeva: This happens. We are not bound by any problems, but they have problems. If there was any obstacle in doing Krsna’s bhajan and in associating with sadhus, then we easily cross over them because we don’t care for the opinion of others. Therefore, we don’t have any problems. But they are running a big society. They face the risk of being kicked out. They care about their reputation. But we don’t care about our reputation; we are carefree. Performing Krsna’s bhajan, we will go anywhere and preach His glories. No one can control us. This is Krsna’s causeless mercy. We are never checked by any problem. Narada doesn’t have any problems. When Sukadeva Gosvami was walking towards the assembly of Pariksit Maharaja, children were throwing stones at him and making fun of him. But, he did not care about anyone.
It makes no difference to me if I am respected or not. I am what I am. Therefore, don’t be worried. They say, “He is a mahapurusa,” and have much respect inside their hearts. But, because of circumstances they are all weeping.
Devotee: Maharaja, the devotees are serving so much and are so eager to hear from you. They offer their dandavat pranamas to you.
Srila Gurudeva: Tell them that they have my blessings.
Devotee: Guruji, I feel that I more inclined to the worship of Lord Rama than Lord Krsna.
Srila Gurudeva: I also felt this way in my childhood. I had the darsana of Lord Rama. And by His mercy, I am in the Gaudiya Vaisnava parampara. Ramacandraji is Krsna’s expansion. But, He has the aspect of maryada (regulative etiquette). He even left Sitaji. But, Krsna did not care for maryada. He accepted everyone unconditionally. By meeting Rama, you will be able to serve Him like Hanumana. This is all right. But, you will not be able to meet Him with all your heart. Bharat, Laksmanaji, and Satrugna always serve Rama. They always fold their hands like sevakas. Sitaji is also there. Rama had Sita sent to the forest because of the allegation of a washer man. Rama is powerful; He can do anything. Was there any fault from Sita’s side? To instruct the world, Rama had Sita sent to the forest. But from His heart, He never left Sita. He would weep in separation from Sita. Sita would always weep in the asrama of Valmiki. Sita-Rama’s two sons were also there in the asrama.
Ramacandraji also put a straw mat in the palace and lived the life of an ascetic like how Sita did. Sitaji would become a little pacified by the association of Valmiki, and her two sons—Lava and Kusa. But there was no one to pacify Rama. He was suffering from much more despair. But no one understands this. He was always remembering Sitaji. There is this consideration in Rama—if someone alleges something on someone, then He will leave that person. But Krsna kicked this quality of maryada like a football. He only takes prema into consideration. He gave the position of a mother to a person who came to feed Him poison while disguised as a mother. Krsna performed such intimate pastimes with the sakhas.
In reciprocation to the selfless love of the gopis, Krsna places His head at the feet of the gopis and makes their maan go far away. Therefore, although Rama and Krsna are non-different, there is rasa-gata-vicara. Radhaji became Sita and Krsna became Rama. Therefore, I used to chant Rama’s names so much in my childhood. I wouldn’t chant Krsna’s names; I would chant, “Rama Rama Hare Hare.” I would chant half of the Mahamantra. Maybe because of my past life’s impressions I chanted Rama’s names in my childhood. Gradually, I started to chant the full Mahamantra. By Ramacandra’s mercy, I got the association of the sadhus. Whenever I give a discourse, I will be sure to intersperse the pastimes of Ramacandraji. I will not be satisfied without speaking about Ramacandra.
Devotee: Maharaja even spoke about Ramacandra’s pastimes yesterday.
Srila Gurudeva: I will surely speak about Ramacandra. I also speak on the history of Sitaji and many other associates of Rama. I also speak and follow the instructions that are given from Sri Ramacandra’s pastimes. I know that Rama and Krsna are One. Therefore, prema is manifested more in the personality of Krsna. Krsna becomes completely subservient to His associates. What does He not do to please the gopis? This is prema.
The moon is always purna, full. But, from certain angles of vision on earth, and because the sun’s reflection doesn’t fall on it, we see a dark moon. We say, “This is the first moon, second moon, third moon, fourth moon, fifth moon.” We judge the size of the moon according to its waxing and waning. But the moon never changes. When we go higher, we will see that the moon is always complete. We can see the full moon. Sometimes, because of darkness, the full moon cannot be seen. Therefore, we say, “First moon; second moon.”
Similarly, when we see Bhagavan in His full form, then He is Krsna. He is emporium of the twelve rasas. Ramacandra also has these rasas, but He does not manifest them. He is Maryada-Purusottama. He is bound by dharmic conduct. If He manifests these rasas, He will become Krsna.
Devotee: Maharaja, it is said that Krsna is the possessor of the sixteen forms of arts and Rama is the possessor of the twelve forms of arts.
Srila Gurudeva: No. It is not like this. The moon has sixteen aspects and the sun has twelve aspects. So, the sun is full in twelve aspects and the moon is full in sixteen aspects.
[Break of audio]
Laksmana cannot give Rama His remnants. Even Sitaji will not give her remnants to Rama. But when Radhaji is eating, Krsna will snatch Her remnants and will blissfully eat them.
Devotee: Krsna also eats the Gvala-balakas’—the cowherd boys’ remnants.
Srila Gurudeva: This is prema. Therefore, the full manifestation of prema is in Krsna. But Rama and Krsna are complete.
There are twelve kinds of rasas—santa, dasya, sakhya, vatsalya, and madhurya are the primary forms of rasa. The secondary forms of rasas are seven in number. They are hasya, karuna, raudra, bhayanak, vibhatsa, vira, and adbhut. Thus, there are twelve kinds of rasas. Krsna is the emporium of the twelve kinds of rasas. Ramacandraji has dasya, santa, and even karuna-rasa. When He was leaving home to enter the forest, there was no such living entity that did not bitterly weep on seeing Rama’s departure from Ayodhya. Everyone also cried at the places where Sita was lamenting in separation from Rama. When Sita entered Patala, everyone bitterly wept. One will not weep for Krsna so easily. But if the devotee does weep, then his eyes will never be dry. Krsna has this quality. He does not weep so easily. After understanding the separation that the gopis felt for Krsna, one’s eyes will never be dry. One will also weep when he chants Hare Krsna without offense.
So, Ramacandraji has the rasas—santa, dasya, and karuna. But He does not have vatsalya-rasa. Why does He not have this rasa? When He was born, He appeared in His caturbhuja form carrying the conch, disc, lotus, and club in His four hands. Kausalyaji also folded her hands and prayed to Him. She forgot her motherly affection for Him.
Devotee: Rama appeared in His caturbhuja form?
Srila Gurudeva: Yes.
Devotee: Krsna also showed His caturbhuja form when He was born.
Srila Gurudeva: He showed this form to Devaki and Vasudeva and not to Nanda and Yasoda. He was born from the womb of Yasoda. Even the umbilical cord cutting ceremony was performed.
Devotee: Krsna showed the universes to Yasoda.
Srila Gurudeva: Yes, He showed the universes to Yasoda, but it was like a magic trick. Yasoda never considered Krsna to be God. Rather, she would chastise Him.
Once, she told Him, “I will not give You milk. Stay away from me.”
Krsna cried out, “Maiya Maiya!”
But Yasoda did not take Krsna in her arms. Smiling, she chastised Krsna. Meanwhile, Naradaji came and saw this sight. He wondered, “This is Parabrahma Himself. Becoming Yasoda’s son, He is rolling on the earth. He is crying and wants to sit on Yasoda’s lap. And Yasoda Maiya refuses to take Him on her lap. And we meditate on Krsna’s feet and pray that He enters our hearts. How fortunate Yasodaji is! No one can bind Krsna; but Yasoda has bound Him by her love.”
But folding her hands in prayer, Kausalyaji offered many stava-stutis to Rama. Therefore, Kausalya’s vatsalya-rasa is half. At times, she forgets that Rama is Parabrahma. But soon after, she remembers that Rama is Parabrahma. Yasodaji never thought of Krsna as Parabrahma.
Devotee: Kausalya knew that Rama is Bhagavan?
Srila Gurudeva: Yes. Therefore, her vatsalya-rasa was not complete. Sometimes, she would forget that Rama is God. But, she always knew that Rama is God. Rama appeared in His caturbhuja form and said, “As a fruit of your austerities, I have come to your house as a son.” He told this to Kausalya just as Krsna told Devaki of her previous lives’ austerities.
He told Vasudeva and Devaki, “In one of your previous lives both of you were Kasyapa Rsi and Aditi. After both of you performed severe austerities, I appeared and offered you both a boon.
You said, ‘We desire a son like You.’
I replied, ‘Where will you get a son like Me? Therefore, I Myself, will come as your son.’”
Dasaratha and Kausalya were also Kasyapa and Aditi in their previous lives. Thus, Rama appeared to them as a result of hearing their prayers. And, they knew that Rama was Parabrahma. As for Yasoda, Krsna emerged from her womb. So she does not believe anyone when they claim that Krsna is God.
She will say, “Krsna is not God; He is my son.”
Therefore, she has so much love for Krsna that she chastises and disciplines Krsna. And, she cannot remain without Krsna. When Ramacandraji left Ayodhya, Maharaja Dasaratha left his body and Kaikeyi became blind.
She thought, “Rama will return after twelve years.” And along with Rama, she went to Vaikuntha.
Yasodaji never thought, “My son is Bhagavan.”
Devotee: When Krsna left Gokula-Vrndavana for Mathura, then what was the condition of Nanda Baba and Yasoda Maiya?
Srila Gurudeva: They became mad in separation and thought, “Where is our son?”
Devotee: They would not go to meet Krsna?
Srila Gurudeva: Krsna would go to meet Nanda-Yasoda. But they would think, “We saw our Lala, our son in our dreams.”
When Yasoda would cook, she would think, “My son will come and eat.”
Indeed, Krsna would come and eat what Yasoda had prepared. He would also talk with her. But she would think, “Am I seeing Krsna in a dream?” And Krsna would never leave them and go anywhere else. He is always in Vrndavana. These pastimes are very deep and confidential. We also want to forget Krsna’s Bhagavatta, His Godhood, and we want to have a relationship with Him like how the gopis do. Everything depends on the relationship with Krsna, and Guru makes this relationship strong. If a relationship is made, then a relationship with all of Krsna’s associates is also made. For instance, now that she is married, her husband’s parents have become her parents also. This relationship has become strong. You will be together in happiness and distress. Guru establishes a relationship between a jiva and Krsna not just for one life; he establishes this relationship forever. This is called diksa. Therefore, we will always be indebted to guru. If a guru cannot do this, then he is not a Sad-Guru. A Sad-Guru binds Krsna in the heart of the disciple; he makes him realize Krsna.
By the grace of the guru, the disciple will think, “When will I leave this material world and serve Krsna in His abode?”
There is no shortage there. There is no birth, death, and sorrows there. Happiness will be experienced there in newer and newer forms. You don’t have to do a job there. You will not have to serve any mundane person there. Krsna is the only enjoyer there. Krsna is suffering for you; He is worried for you. The love shared between a devotee and Krsna is not to be found within any relationship of this material world.
One need only take shelter of Krsna’s Priyaji, Srimati Radhika. Krsna just desires; but everything is arranged by His sakti. Srimati Radhaji is the power, the sakti, the energy of Krsna. She is Hladini-sakti. She is controlling everything and not Krsna. Krsna lifted Giriraja-Govardhana on the little finger of His left hand. What is the meaning of this? Radhaji is always on the left side of Krsna. The little finger is also on the extreme left of the left hand.
This finger is considered to be feminine; so Radhaji lifted Giriraja-Govardhana. Krsna desired to lift Giriraja and Radhaji lifted Giriraja for Krsna. People think Krsna lifted Giriraja-Govardhana but He did not lift Giriraja.
These pastimes are filled with many secrets. Why did Krsna lift Giriraja? The gopis who had just become kisoris and were newly married wanted to meet Krsna. But they were unable to. So, Krsna caught Indra and had Yogamaya call him. All the arrangements were then made. Profuse rainfall was arranged and Krsna lifted Giriraja-Govardhana. There was no other place the Vrajavasis could seek shelter except being under Govardhana. Now, the newly married gopis collected under Govardhana on the excuse of rainfall and looked at Krsna to their hearts’ content. The meeting of the gopis and Krsna underneath Govardhana was filled with so much bliss. This is the secret behind the pastime of Krsna lifting Giriraja-Govardhana. Krsna arranged this pastime just so He could meet the gopis. If someone meets Krsna by having prema that has many obstacles to overcome, then there is much bliss in that prema.
One will always be greatly anxious to meet Krsna. “When will I meet Krsna? When will I meet Krsna?” will be the only thought. There is so much bliss in this prema. And those, who are always meeting Krsna, are satisfied in their hearts. They may be complacent. They will think, “Even if there is a fight; no harm.”
But if a meeting happens after great difficulty, then that prema will be of a greater degree. Therefore, these pastimes are arranged.
Putana came to Vraja; but know that no ghost, goblin, or demon can enter Vraja. Only to renew the prema of the Vrajavasis, do such pastimes occur. How? Yasodaji and Krsna are together. Yasoda thinks, “Krsna is my son.”
While cooking, she tells Krsna, “Oh go and play in the house. Don’t disturb me.”
Meanwhile, Putana came and taking Krsna, she flew in the sky. She had smeared poison on her breasts and by breastfeeding Krsna, she wanted to kill Him. When Putana flew away with Krsna, Yasoda left everything aside and cried out for her son.
She thought, “A son was born to me even though I am sixty years old. And even He is going away.”
She started to bitterly weep and she fell unconscious on the ground. And the gopis ran behind Krsna. They took Krsna from the place where Putana had fallen and placed Him in the hands of Yasoda. Yasoda became inconceivable happy. Now, she never leaves Krsna.
She doesn’t tell Him, “Don’t disturb me. Go and play.”
She has Krsna in her arms throughout the day. In this way, demons like Sakatasura, Trnavarta, Aghasura, Bakasura, Pralambhasura, and many others appeared in Vraja to renew the prema of the Vrajavasis. One finds a priceless jewel; but what will be the condition if someone steals it? The person will be thinking about it day and night. If he finds the jewel again, then he will always keep it with him. He may put it an iron chest or in a bank locker. He will understand its value.
This boy is always with you. Now, you may not understand how important he is to you. But if he goes somewhere for a couple of days, you will not be able to sleep. Your house will seem empty. You can scold and discipline him. But if he goes somewhere for a few days, then you will realize how precious your son is to you. You will realize what “mamata” is. Therefore, why does Krsna go to Mathura from Vrndavana? In the eternal abode Krsna doesn’t go anywhere. Only in His pastimes in this world, does He go to Mathura. Why does He go? To make the Vrajavasis understand a deeper side of love. There are two sides to prema—samyoga and viyoga. They are meeting and separation respectively. What is viyoga? It means “visesa yoga.” Vi-yoga—yoga means meeting and “vi,” means in a special way. When Krsna goes far away, His associates constantly think about Him. When Krsna went far away from the gopis, He would always think about them.
He would think, “The gopis served Me in so many ways. They love Me so much. They would put many flower garlands on Me. Without Me, they cannot stay alive for a minute. Alas! Alas!”
Day and night, Krsna would think about the gopis. This is called, “Viyoga,” a special form of meeting. Externally, it seems there is no meeting between Krsna and the gopis. In Samyoga, Krsna and the gopis meet externally, but something is lost inside. But, there is a special form of meeting in viyoga although they don’t meet externally. So, this internal meeting is greater. There is realization here. This prema is spotless. Hence, Krsna had this form of love shown to everyone. How can everyone realize how exalted the love of the gopis and Yasoda’s love for Krsna is? Through viyoga, it is known of how much they suffer in separation from Krsna. If we are not able to meet Krsna, we should also lament like this in separation from Krsna. This is called bhajan; we will not be able to live without Krsna. We cannot live for a second without the presence of air. We will start to die without breathing air. A fish will not survive when it is taken out of water. There is no need of killing it; it will die on its own.
Caitanya Mahaprabhu said, “I don’t have a scent of Krsna-prema. If I did have prema, then without Krsna’s darsana, why haven’t I died yet? This can only mean that I don’t have prema. If I had prema then I would have died. My cries for Krsna are an external display.”
Thus, prema has two sides—viyoga and samyoga. Viyoga is more important than samyoga because then, we will realize if prema is pure or not. This will not be realized during meeting. But when there is viyoga, when there is intense separation from Krsna, then the greatness of prema will be realized. The gopis became mad in separation from Krsna. Sitaji did not become mad in separation from Rama. She was always conscious although she bitterly wept. But she did desire to enter in a fire and give up her life. Her prema reached up to this state. But Radhaji became viyogini and became completely mad in separation from Krsna. So, this is viyoga. When there is prema, there will be viyoga and samyoga. In the mood of samyoga, Krsna stayed in Vrndavana for eleven years. Then the time of viyoga drew near. Hence, in the Bhagavat, it is written how high the stage of viyoga is. This is the nature of prema.
[Srila Gurudeva speaks to a devotee]
Only have faith in Krsna. He creates, sustains, and destroys the creation. He nourishes everyone. He will also look after you and your daughters. He will always save you. Have firm faith in Him.
Devotee: Maharaja, it is written that if the husband dies before the wife, then the wife is very unfortunate.
Srila Gurudeva: No. This is for those, who have an external understanding. They don’t know anything, so it is said for them. You are not this body. Even your husband is not his body. The material body is made of earth and other elements. What you said is meant for those who have no knowledge; they are foolish. But, for those who have knowledge, Krsna is their husband. So, they will never be widows—if they consider Krsna as their husband. In reality, only Krsna nourishes and saves us.
What is the meaning of pati? Pa means a person who looks after another. It also refers to one who relieves someone of distress. Therefore, Krsna is Parama-pati, the topmost husband. Your husband was with you for some years; even your sons and brothers will be with you for some years. In reality, they are spirit souls. The spirit soul never takes birth or dies. Only Krsna is the spirit soul’s all-in-all. But having forgotten Krsna, we are in this material world suffering from sorrow. We have forgotten Krsna. Therefore, society considers one spirit soul as a lady’s husband and when he dies, the lady is considered very unfortunate. It should not be understood this way.
Understand Krsna to be your Parama-pati and regard your husband as your pati. Only Krsna can save us and only He is our all-in-all. He will always rescue us. Now that your husband has departed, how can he save you? But, Krsna can save you because He is Parama-pati. Therefore, consider Him as such. Don’t consider yourself to be a widow. You are separated from your husband. This was bound to happen—either today, tomorrow, or after some years. You may have departed before him also. Viyoga, separation, is bound to happen after a hundred years. Either of you will have to leave the body before the other does. Your husband was a pandit; he did Bhagavan’s bhajan. His time was over and Prabhu called him near. Don’t be worried. You do Krsna’s bhajan; He supplies everything to everyone. Have firm faith in this.
One day, one man went to do Krsna’s bhajan. When he went near the border of the village, he thought, “Where will I stay? What will I eat? What will I do?”
Meanwhile, he saw some people breaking a stone hill. They were removing big blocks of stone. As they did so, a frog leaped out. The man thought, “There is no way for an animal to enter into this stone hill. There is no way inside. There is no air to breathe also. There is nothing inside to survive on. How did this frog manage to survive within these big blocks of stone? So, if Krsna gives something for the frog to survive on, then He will surely tend to my needs as well.”
He then noticed an egg on the branch of a tree. As the wind blew, the egg fell from its nest and it broke open. A fledgling appeared from the egg and it cried out in hunger. Its mother was not there and this egg fell on the earth. Now what will this fledgling eat? Then, an insect came and the baby bird sat on it. It then ate the insect.
The man thought, “Prabhu has managed to feed everyone.”
The baby bird got some food and its hunger was satisfied. So, if Krsna bestows His mercy even on birds and other animals, then will He not bestow His mercy on us as well?
[Srila Gurudeva speaks to the devotee whose husband has passed away]
Therefore, don’t care for the opinion of others. Maintain your life by some means and be engaged in Krsna’s bhajan. Try to look after your daughters and everything will be all right. We always have full faith in Krsna. I don’t do anything to obtain prasadam. If I am destined to be fed prasadam, then who can stop me from honoring prasadam? Rice and dal from India is cooked. Many varieties are being prepared.
Devotee 2: Upon your coming here, even our business has started to prosper Maharaja.
Srila Gurudeva: I thought, “Where has this beautiful dal come from?” They then told me that their business is based on dal.
So, it is written in our destiny that we honor prasadam. I don’t give in charity or do anything else; but so many people love me and all arrangements are being made for me. Now, I am travelling all over the world in an airplane. I don’t have a single penny in my pocket. How is everything being managed? There is a Person who is arranging everything. I am helpless; I cannot do anything. Although I don’t do anything, all arrangements are being made. Wherever I go, everything is arranged. Earlier, what relation did I have with them? They have one son and daughter but I have millions of sons and daughters. Wherever I go, I get new sons and daughters.
In Delhi, there are some devotees, who will give millions of rupees if ever asked for. But I never asked them nor am I in need of any money. I don’t have any need of anything.
Visnu dasa: Maharaja, we only want to be qualified to become your sons and daughters.
Srila Gurudeva: Prema is needed. This prema should reach Krsna by the medium of a guru. If someone has even a little prema for Krsna, then if we take one step, Krsna will come down and taking lakhs and lakhs of steps, He will come near us. We are eager to meet Krsna, but Krsna is more eager to meet us.
Krsna always thinks, “What arrangements can I make, so that on hearing My name being chanted even once, I will run to meet him and I will embrace him.”
Krsna is so causelessly merciful. He says, “You have forgotten me since so much time. I was suffering in separation from you.”
Devotee: Maharaja has to go now.
Srila Gurudeva: I feel so happy in speaking hari-katha.
Devotee: We feel that we want to continue listening from you forever.